Bob Welch and the disappearance of Mystery to Me and Heroes are Hard to Find...
 

Can someone please explain to me why Bob Welch was so completely removed from FM history? No Hall of Fame, no FM BW records on Rhapsody or I-tunes? Wth? Did I miss something huge?:shrug:

I've never searched for Fleetwood Mac on iTunes since I own every Mac/solo album in CD/LP form. It is strange all of the Pre 1970 & post 1975 albums are present, yet no 1970-1974 albums are. I have a couple of guesses:

1) Maybe there is some sort of lawsuit involving Wendy Welch in regards to Bob's royalties since his passing? Perhaps she's holding Bob's rights as a way to strong-arm Fleetwood Mac into getting Bob inducted into the Rock & Roll Hall Of Fame?

2) Perhaps the Welch era albums are in the process of being remastered/rereleased? I know albums which are about to be remastered/rereleased go into Out Of Print status beforehand.

3) Could Warner Bros/Fleetwood Mac management be attempting to streamline Fleetwood Mac history by simplifying it?

I'm hedging my bet on some aspect of #1 being correct.

I was wondering about court cases with Bob Welches death recently. But, it just goes along with some of the truly weird stuff this organization has been part of over the years, I guess. Of course, I simply don't know squat...just rubs me the wrong way!:(

Trying to push the Welch years under the rug is criminal. Mystery To Me is the best FM album ever made!

Interesting. #2 reminds me of when Stevie said that her albums were being remastered, and then they all went OOP. They even got 'new' release dates on Amazon, which turned out to be the same old CDs we've had all along.

FWIW, "Penguin" and "Mystery To Me" were, respectively, the last Fleetwood Mac albums to be reissued on CD back in 1990 or so, which could explain the delay.

There could be any number of glitches along the way. I'm not sure how much say Wendy would get in how material is released. Warner Bros. probably still owns the mechanical rights, and I've heard that Mich Reynolds got the rights to the music in the divorce from Cliff Adams. Now, the Mich/Cliff thing isn't an issue from "Heroes" onward, so I can't explain why "Heroes" isn't out.

I think it's criminal, too, whatever the differences. Just wrong...

And, like I said, Bob Welch is really the one who took FM into the realm of the mystical and I'm sure that was a huge draw for SN when she listened to all of FM's records. She has said that LB did the mystical thing with her, so for him perhaps as well. That element, on top of amazing players is what I believe convinced SN they should join FM. I'm not so sure that they would have been so interested without Bob Welch's influences:shrug:

I disagree. I think "The Supernatural" (okay, not technically Fleetwood Mac), "Black Magic Woman," and "The Green Manalishi" all set a precedent.

Ok, so that leaves Green Manalishi and Black Magic Woman...but really since it was SN who supposedly did the listening since it seems LB would have stuck to BN without her push...the BW stuff IMO would be more to SN's taste? Maybe, maybe not?

I agree there's some overlap between Bob and Stevie, and I think that's why the "Rumours" had a fairly easy time winning over the old Fleetwood Mac fans. However, I'm just saying that Peter Green certainly brought a mystic vibe to the band's music. That being said, I actually think Stevie as well as Lindsey probably more closely identified with Danny Kirwan's sound.

On a different note, "A Hard Road" was the first album that featured two members of Fleetwood Mac, and ironically, two of Peter Green's contributions to that record were "The Supernatural" and "Leaping Christine" which is pretty eerie in retrospect.

Bob even said he had no say even while he was alive, so I doubt Wendy has much pull at all.

I've known big companies to drop or bury things like a hot potato at the slightest hint of legal trouble or simply anyone being offended. I am however hoping it is the remastered editions coming scenario following the new editions of Then Play On through to Bare Trees!

I remember ordering Penguin and Heroes CDs from (West) Germany when they were hard to find in America. But really, Mac fans have nothing on Badfinger fans who saw Warner LPs pulled from sale right after release and then unavailable in any form for decades. :distress:

I think it's also worth remembering that Then Play On and Kiln House aren't on iTunes either so I think it's more a case of Warner/Reprise not really feeling the pre-Buckingham/Nicks stuff on their roster is commercially viable, though the new CD remaster of Then Play On would appear to suggest otherwise.

I never knew that (I don't use iTunes). Let's hope as mentioned the newly released Then Play On shows the record companies that there is a market for this era and it gets on iTunes at least.

Yeah, I felt disappointed that those albums weren't on iTunes, because MTM especially is one of my fave albums from the band. But at least with these remasters, there is hope.

Bring on the remasters
 

I don't understand how anything can remain out of print, particularly in this digital age with Itunes etc. It's just asking for piracy. Surely the record company can just make it available online (or via HDTracks *hint hint*), and if no-one buys it - oh well, at least they didn't print 1,000,000 CD's.

I was also shocked when I couldn't find any of the Welch era FM on Spotify, although Bob's solo work is well represented.

Would love to see a remaster of Mystery to Me as I find I am listening to that album more than any other lately.

I'll never forget the pleasant surprise when I bought the vinyl many years ago, just on a whim because I was wanting to complete my FM discography - it ended up hooking me from the start, and I feel "Why" is one of the best FM songs ever.

If I had a freakin' turntable, I would have bought vinyls of those too.

Radio IO, Reprise Records October 2013

http://www.radioio.com/2013/10/40-ye...mystery-to-me/

40 Years Ago: Fleetwood Mac Release ‘Mystery to Me’

By the start of 1973, Fleetwood Mac were in a state of flux, trying to find solid footing and an identity for the band. The recent departure of longtime guitarist Danny Kirwin led to a fluctuating lineup, with the addition of guitarists Bob Weston and Bob Welch, as well as Dave Walker, who would supply some of the vocals on Mac’s first 1973 offering, ‘Penguin.’ But the overstuffed lineup didn’t last long, and by the time sessions started for their next album, ‘Mystery to Me,’ Walker was gone, and Welch had settled into his role as frontman.

Fleetwood Mac were somewhat out of step in their homeland in 1973. A landscape of glam and prog made little room for the group’s more homespun sound. But in the U.S., things were starting to look up for the band: ‘Penguin’ hit the charts, and people began showing up at their shows.

That summer, the band started work on a new album and once again called upon producer Martin Birch for assistance. “‘Mystery to Me’ was probably the best Fleetwood Mac album since Peter Green had left the band three years earlier,” Mick Fleetwood wrote in his 1990 autobiography, ‘Fleetwood: My Life and Adventures in Fleetwood Mac.’ “It was atmospheric and intelligent, and we knew it was going to be a big hit.”

It was also the album that finally opened the door to radio play for the band in the U.S. “We sensed we were on the verge of a breakthrough and had another real shot at the Big Time in the U.S.A.,” Fleetwood wrote. ‘Mystery to Me’ cracked the Top 70 and eventually went gold.

Most of the songs on the album were written by Welch, with only a handful penned by Christine McVie. But they rank among her all-time best. ‘Mystery to Me’ kicks off with ‘Emerald Eyes,’ which features what would become Mac trademarks, like radio-friendly production, clean vocals and tasteful guitar work, while McVie’s ‘Believe Me’ and ‘Just Crazy Love’ could have come from the band’s first two hit records with Lindsey Buckingham and Stevie Nicks.

But it’s Welch’s ‘Hypnotized’ that caught fans’ ears. Originally written as a raw blues, but later rearranged as a dreamlike pop song, the cut’s shuffling rhythm and smooth guitars are hard to resist. It not only netted the band some well-deserved FM airplay, the song remained in Mac’s live sets after Welch left. “I was reading about, as the lyric says, ‘a place down in Mexico where man can fly over mountains and hills,’” Welch is quoted in Fleetwood’s book. “One night I had a vivid dream that a UFO piloted by a Navajo shaman landed on out overgrown grass tennis court one moonlit night. That was the feeling that went into ‘Hypnotized’.”

Other LP highlights include the Welch-penned but McVie-sung ‘Keep on Going,’ and ‘Miles Away,’ a grooving Welch rocker. A cover of the Yardbirds hit ’For Your Love’ was a late addition to the album, but it’s given enough of a Mac stamp to fit onto ‘Mystery to Me.’ McVie’s ‘Why’ ends the album on a haunting and beautiful note, with some fine slide-guitar work by Weston, who would soon be ousted from the band because of his extracurricular activities with Fleetwood’s wife. And you thought the group’s internal drama started when Buckingham and Nicks joined?

ACK!! I hate it when major publications can't spell.:mad: K-I-R-W-A-N!!!!



If my chronology is correct, wasn't the Fleetwood Mac's initial back catalogue CD releases happening while Bob's royalty lawsuit was in process? That's probably why Penguin & Mystery To Me were held up being released until that was settled. Those MAY have been the two albums of royalty payments that Bob was disputing, since Future Games, Bare Trees, & Heroes Are Hard To Find were released with the rest. Since Germany wasn't covered by the US/UK copyright laws, they were able to release those two on CD way ahead of time.

Becca, I think Pete Ham's suicide was a major factor in Warner Bros deleting those 2 Badfinger LPs...especially the Wish You Were Here album. (that and their own lofty expectations of record sales caused them to over-manufacture the number of albums, necessitating them to cut their losses by selling unsold units to rack-jobbers (being why in just a few weeks after release, those Badfinger albums, despite both being great musically, ended up in cut-out bins in record stores). Plus, it didn't help that both WB & Apple released Badfinger albums (WB with the self-titled album; Apple with the Ass album) within just days of each other.

Have seen Danny Kirwin and Bob Welsh in print more than once. :(

Interesting thoughts about the final three Bob/FM albums on CD back then. Makes sense.

What happened with the Badfinger WB albums was before Pete Ham was dead. Their U.S. guy who negotiated the WB deal took all the money meant to be in escrow after starting some kind of corporation named Badfinger Inc. This somehow forced WB to sue the band adding to their stress on top of not seeing money their U.S. manager promised. Plus there were Apple royalties all in escrow as well they couldn't touch if they even knew it was there. WB pulled the Wish You Were Here LP fairly shortly after release. Despite that the group began recording a third WB album to help fix things (minus a rightly disgruntled Joey Molland who saw no light ever coming). That third album was finally released as Head First and is excellent. It is the worst story I've ever heard about the music biz.

I thought it was about two or more years prior. I thought Bob said everything came to a head with the box set, which came out two years after MTM's rerelease.

I got my first CD (white FM) on 12/31/1989, and all but Penguin and Mystery were out from the WB days.

Bob Welch from Wendy Welch
 

There are no lawsuits since Bob's death, no fights over royalties, pulishing or otherwise, and no reason for Bob to be deleted from anything FM. I don't know what the band thinks they are doing.

No conflicts with FM/Bob Welch
 

There have been no conflicts with Bob Welch or any members of FM prior to 2000.
So what gives. The label should be putting out his albums. Request them from Warner Brothers/Reprise if you want them released. They could have made a lot more money since Bob's death, unless Chris, John and Mick prevented them from being released. I know that Rhino wanted to do a Tribute album to Bob Welch and couldn't get permission from the other three members last fall. So take it for what it's worth. Rhino and I even had all the song titles selected for the album, when they could't get an approval from Warners and the three band members.

Bob Welch being denied his musical legacy
 

The only answer I can give you is that FM is trying to delete and break "The Chain" of the band between the years 1971 and 1975 as if it never existed You can go on all of their sites and look at the discography ob "Fleetwood Mac News" on Facebook and it is as if these years never existed and as if Bob Welch never existed. They may not like me, but Bob Welch gave his heart and soul to that band and they have treated him horrendously. He cared so much that his music would live on and about his legacy and the band members that he loved and gave so much to left him out of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame 15 years ago. Ask them on their sites why, even though they said "Bob saved Fleetwood Mac" and there never would have been a Stevie or Lindsey had he not moved them to LA, they don't still consider him an honorable band member and have deleted him from his rightful place in the band and have removed his musical legacy and history from the band.:shrug: Please help Bob to fight for what's his due!

That's very disappointing. :mad:

I know of another case where that initially happened to Rhino over something originally on the Reprise label, but that was sorted out after awhile. The only legitimate reason would be if they were planning to rerelease something themself and that couldn't be true here. This info really does show someone is vengeful to me. :distress:

If Bob did something in a state of needing funds badly years ago and someone took offense they need to get over that. Maybe it would help to say there are studies that prove the brain physically changes under prolonged stress or pain, but I don't know. Even if there were no plans to include Bob in the hall of fame honor whatever happened to taking a step of 'generosity' for one's own good and soul? I did mail a letter to the hall a few months ago as one of those few things a mere fan can do, but I guess it's true someone from the group needs to become a bigger person... a.s.a.p.

It's possible non-music centric magazines could have an interest in an article on this situation. I know Rolling Stone would be unlikely rock any industry boats, possibly annoy your biggest advertisers? That's not going to happen.

Response to the prior post
 

Bob Welch never did anything in a state of needing money. Let's get that straight right now. :shrug: Don't know where that came from! And he definitely never did anything under stress or pain! By the way, Bob had never been suicidal. The drug lyrica murdered him as far as I am concerned. He had had neck surgery 3 months prior and was given Lyrica exactly 6 weeks before the suicide and left me a 9 page love letter that showed what that drug had done to his mind. There were 3 class action suits against that drug for loved ones who committed suicide after taking it. They all had to be dropped and done as individuals a month before Bob died. We were not told of any of the warnings that we should have been told by law from the doctor, the pharmacist enclosure, or anyting else. I found out about this 10 days after his death from a pharmacist about how bad that drug can be. It helps some, but kills many. <3 Broke my heart.

But thank you so much for the rest of your caring post.

Wendy,

There are so many Fleetwood Mac fans that love Bob and the music that he helped create in those years. Some of my most favorite FM songs come from that time. He will never be forgotten.

I loved "His Fleetwood Mac Years & Beyond" collection, signed by the man himself. One of my favorites from it is "Like Rain". He and his music will always be a part of FM. No one can ever take that away from him or the fans that adore him.

I feel like you are grieving still and I wish you peace.

Sadly it isn't just Bob that FM wants to write out of their history. They'd also like us to forget Dave Walker, Bob Weston, Dave Mason, Bekka Bramlett and perhaps to a lesser extent Billy Burnette and Rick Vito.

Interestingly enough none of them made it to the RRHOF either.

Bob Welch and perhaps also Billy Burnette were the most glaring omissions, but I've said it before and I'll say it again and again, every single of of them should have been inducted.

:shrug:

Yeah well Mason was inducted with Traffic anyway so not sure what they thought they were saving there. :)

John

Apologies Wendy, I was projecting (and offering guesses) based on my experiences that helped some people in another situation. I did know a musician who after yet another failed spine operation made a decision to end the pain, and some people were very angry with him and there was fighting between people who saw things very differently.

:sorry:

http://hippiesstolemyblog.blogspot.c...-dreaming.html

Bob Welch/Pro rata share member
 

One thing that you should know that Bob was a pro rata share member, which meant that he shared share equally with all members in the band: i.e. Chris,John and Mick.

I believe that the others should have been equally inducted in the RRHOF but Billy Burnett, Becka Bamlett, and Rick Vito, among others were never members. In fact, I was told, not sure if it's a fact but was told from some musicians in the band, that they were let go they day before they were to become equal members - pro rata share members- and were totally cut off. Check it out for yourselves. I will not say it is true, but I personally have every reason to believe it. and that is why they weren't put up for the RRHOF because Mick hired them when Stevie, Chris and Lindsey wouldn't play with FM and he wanted to keep the band going.

That's interesting. Was that written in a contract or is that something that
automatically happens after a certain amount of time - the pro rata share thing?

Pro Rata Share Memver/Bob Welch
 

It was written in a contract.

Interesting that Billy wasn't made a pro rata share member, since he was the second longest tenured guitarist behind Lindsey.

Maybe Mick didn't like that he left and came back? Just a thought.

John

In terms if public perception, and very likely in Mick's mind, much of the Burnette years were seen as a holding pattern, keeping the band afloat while the members of the Rumours lineup worked out their issues. The band appeared to take Behind the Mask seriously and maybe at the start there was an attempt to fully relaunch the band sans Lindsey. But when it became clear that 4/5 of that lineup were not enough to hold the same level of public interest as 5/5 had, the momentum seems to have petered out.

Not so with the Welch years. One doesn't get the sense from those 1971-74 albums that FM is in a holding pattern waiting for the return of the classic lineup. Instead one sees genuine commitment to forge ahead and develop a new sound. They were not always successful, but artistically those Welch-era records are very rewarding in a way Mask is not. There's no question Welch should have been inducted as an important member of the band. I do not feel equally enthusiastic about Burnette, Vito, Walker, Bramlett, or Mason, despite liking them all and really enjoying much of the music on Time.

I have a soft spot for Weston and would have loved to see him inducted as well, but I understand the band's and/or academy's decision not to include him.

Just my two cents.

Really, the only two who weren't inducted that deserved it were Bob Welch and Billy Burnette. Billy was on nearly three albums worth of new material (one selling more than all of the Welch-era albums combined, at least prior to 1975) and a live video during his eight years with the band. Substitute or no, eight years is a long time to be in a band and get passed over.

Bob Welch/Billy Burnett
 

I do not believe that all your facts are correct about the years or the album sales.
In fact, I though Rick Vito and Becka were in as long as Billy Burnett. and Becka was certainly the star as well as Rick Vito.

Billy 1987-96
Rick 1987-91
Bekka & Dave M 1993-96

Hope that clears things up re lengths of time in the band.

True, but due to Billy's break in service, it's hard to know how much to deduct for that.

John