Dating Preferences (Relocated Thread)

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by LittleCharmer

I don't know many 18 year-olds who have this, either. It's an untrue, media-created image. I'd wager there are just as many 40 year olds with great bodies, and likewise many 18 year-olds who do have a clear idea of what they want in a man.
Stereotypes get right on my wick

My assumption is that 18-year-olds generally don't work out or diet because... well... they're 18! In your 30's and 40's, you can either choose to allow yourself to go to seed, or you can choose to fight the effects of age, gravity and metabolism. So if you see a hottie-puh-tottie 40-year-old walking around, chances are, he/she is working very hard at it. Accordingly, they're probably going to have firmer/tighter/leaner/fitter bodies than the 18-year-old who eats junk and does not work out.

[ButterCookie]

It's discussions, assumptions and accusations like these that make women "bitter". As if we need horribly misogynistic men yacking down our ears about how 'fat' we are, how 'crummy' our cooking is, telling us our houses aren't clean. When something is repeated enough times it 'becomes truth'. So each time a derogatory post about middle aged women is made, it roots itself deeper into the mind of the woman reading it (in some cases, this is. I know the majority of the women here are rightfully self confident and wouldn't believe such lies) and she begins to believe that she's fat and that she can't cook. And hey presto, you've damaged her possibly beyond repair.

Homer, have you ever stopped to think what kinda crap your drummer gives or has given his wife in the past? Or if her family have ground her down so much that she feels she has to put up a front which makes you now describe her as able to give lessons to Hitler? There are reasons for everything. I used to be so aggressive it was unreal but it was because I had a crummy home life and was fighting battles with myself over a million and one things at once, all caused because I was scared to death of how people perceive me. I'm not a beeotch for the fun of it.

My dad is in his mid 40's somewhere and he cheated on my mum with one of his pupils (he's a driving instructor). I don't speak to him now, not solely because of this, but it contributes. He was in a position of care and he outright abused it. I know that most 40+ men aren't in these positions of care but those 20 year old girls are young enough to be your daughters. Imagine if you did have a 20 y/o daughter and she came home with a 40 year old? You'd probably kick him out of the house and down the street before grounding her and telling her to be more sensible. This paragraph isn't aimed at just Homer, btw.

Also, can I just point out. I'd rather sleep with a woman like Joan Jett than most girls my own age. She's experienced but not bittered, she's wise, she's more toned than any under 25's I've seen lately and I bet she wouldn't lie like a corpse in the bedroom

[DefDumbandBlond]

Completely agree Georgie. ^

Nice last bit there too Oddly the few women that I am attracted to *not pointing fingers at a certain Miss Harry in my signature there * aren't near my age either.

[RickRobert]

Great post Georgie, with you 100%

Originally Posted by DefDumbandBlond

Nice last bit there too Oddly the few women that I am attracted to *not pointing fingers at a certain Miss Harry in my signature there * aren't near my age either.

I feel the same way, with girls I'm attracted to it probably ranges from 16 up to the late 60's, but with dudes it's mostly in the 30's/40's

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by ButterCookie

It's discussions, assumptions and accusations like these that make women "bitter". As if we need horribly misogynistic men yacking down our ears about how 'fat' we are, how 'crummy' our cooking is, telling us our houses aren't clean. When something is repeated enough times it 'becomes truth'. So each time a derogatory post about middle aged women is made, it roots itself deeper into the mind of the woman reading it (in some cases, this is. I know the majority of the women here are rightfully self confident and wouldn't believe such lies) and she begins to believe that she's fat and that she can't cook. And hey presto, you've damaged her possibly beyond repair.

Homer, have you ever stopped to think what kinda crap your drummer gives or has given his wife in the past? Or if her family have ground her down so much that she feels she has to put up a front which makes you now describe her as able to give lessons to Hitler? There are reasons for everything. I used to be so aggressive it was unreal but it was because I had a crummy home life and was fighting battles with myself over a million and one things at once, all caused because I was scared to death of how people perceive me. I'm not a beeotch for the fun of it.

My dad is in his mid 40's somewhere and he cheated on my mum with one of his pupils (he's a driving instructor). I don't speak to him now, not solely because of this, but it contributes. He was in a position of care and he outright abused it. I know that most 40+ men aren't in these positions of care but those 20 year old girls are young enough to be your daughters. Imagine if you did have a 20 y/o daughter and she came home with a 40 year old? You'd probably kick him out of the house and down the street before grounding her and telling her to be more sensible. This paragraph isn't aimed at just Homer, btw.

Also, can I just point out. I'd rather sleep with a woman like Joan Jett than most girls my own age. She's experienced but not bittered, she's wise, she's more toned than any under 25's I've seen lately and I bet she wouldn't lie like a corpse in the bedroom

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what you said, but you can't deny that Homer speaks from a place of truth- his truth- and his posts were not meant to inflame or offend others maliciously. You can either go through life with blinders on and assume that everyone appreciates internal beauty as much as external beauty and that age is age-less. But that's not realistic; everyone has their likes and dislikes, and everyone places different values on different traits. If anything, the real issue here is how/why some women choose to internalize the opinions of other people. Why can't we all just agree to disagree on matters that are highly subjective? Just because Homer is the only one to vocalize (text-ize?) his opinions doesn't mean he is the only who shares those views. The reality is that many (if not most) men prefer younger women, even if they are less sophisticated or worldly. As Patty Stanger (The Millionaire Matchmaker) often says, "The penis does the picking." It's in the DNA- the desire to mate with someone who is fertile and has a better chance of successfully producing offspring. And for whatever reason, the female of the species "dries up" faster than the male of the species, e.g., Rod Stewart being a new father in his sixties (shudders). Accordingly, the sexual allure of the female expires much more quickly than the male's. I'm not writing the rules; I'm just telling it like it is. Reality sucks, and women have an especially brutal road to travel as they age. It's not sheer coincidence that women are still the primary consumers of cosmetic surgical procedures.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by BTFLCHLD

and your post could create domestic issues they aren't prepared for. that's all.

They have no clue of the Ledge(afaik), or my identity here, even if they did. They just know I'm a big FM fan, period. I did just realize that my picture of Cash, would be a dead giveaway, though...

Even though we're all friendLY, we're not really friends(as in, we don't hang out together - the 2 to 3 weekends a month, we play together, is enough! ).

[skcin]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

Maybe I am full of sh*t? Opinions vary. It DOES seem like you're looking for an argument, though. I WILL say this.

Do you know the main difference in a 20yo woman, versus a 40yo woman? The former is almost always open minded, fun loving, and carefree. The latter is often bitter, jaded, argumentative, and very little fun to be around. Not pointing any fingers, just sayin'...you DO seem to be taking my preferences, personally.
Little chub? I'd say up to 20lbs over their ideal weight.

Yes, I'm interested in a long term relationship. No kids, though. Bleck.

No, the 19yo is just a friend, that we'd both considered taking it to another level. We BOTH decided that it wasn't the right thing. I was relieved, to be honest.

I am seriously dating the 23yo. However, a grad student has very little free time, and I'm being held to about 2 dates a week. I AM a very impatient person, but I'm slowly learning self restraint.

These are your opinions, dude, yet you write them as fact. My opinion is that it's pretty f*cked up to think that way & make mass assumptions based on a few people you know. If you made these same type of blanket stereotypical assumptions about black people, Asian people, whoever based on your personal experience with 2 or 3 of them, you'd be a racist. Just saying.


And I'm a 35 year old who has a better body that I did when I was 20 so I have nothing to be bitter about, only to be proud of. I'm healthy, in shape & in a happy, monogamous long-term relationship with my husband. Is he attracted to 20 year olds? Of course, what man wouldn't be? But he bangs me, despite that fact that I'm a bitter, over the hill harpy according to your standards.

I think what's bugging me about your posts is that I was under the impression that you wanted to find love. It's just that I don't think that's going to happen by serial dating younger chicks you meet at the bar. If all you want is a good time & to feel attractive (which you're equating to thin, but that's a whole other topic) then you're all set I guess. But I swore I remember you posting in the past that you're lonely & want to find the right person - no?

The reason I asked about the 23 year old is if you're serious about her, why are you still dating other chicks, like the 19 year old you "drew the line" at?

Originally Posted by chiliD

^^^^
According to that chart, I am NOT overweight, I'm just too short. I really should be about 7'5" instead of 6'.

You're just short for your weight.

Originally Posted by mezzoforte

PEOPLE AGE. We all do. In the next twenty years, I will grow older, wiser, more experienced. Maybe I will become more bitter--I have no idea! But I'll also know myself better, and be less inhibited. I look at my mother (age 44) and see someone who has grown infinitely stronger and braver just in the last few years. She hasn't become bitter in the least, and my father continues to adore her. This is true of many of the middle aged women I know. We all change with age, and some of those changes will be positive, others negative.
The 22-year-olds you're after now will be 40 someday. I guess you can never get married, or enter into a long-term partnership, lest your partner grow less "open-minded" (a quality you obviously possess in abundance!).
Not everyone has to want a long-term relationship (I'm not certain I see it for myself). But are you really going to keep chasing these 22-year-olds when you're 50? 60? Certainly, that's your call. But don't those guys always seem pathetic? They do to me.
You don't have to want to be with someone wise, experienced--someone of your generation. Maybe you'll always prefer young, enthusiastic women. But please don't use blanket statements about how by 40, I'll be "no fun to be around." I'm trying very hard to be reasoned in my responses, but I have to be blunt here: that's a revolting, presumptuous, insensitive thing to say.Anyway, I can't stop you from having preferences, and I completely understand why almost all males would choose younger women. But the way you've been putting things often sounds kind of gross--at least, to some of us.
It's a sensitive topic for women. Heck, I'm not even in any of the groups you've insulted (I'm a young woman, and I, too, am underweight according to that chart).

Society is breathtakingly unfair in its treatment of men and women as they age. And even as a young woman, it terrifies me that I'll be considered "bitter and jaded," not to mention sexually undesirable by 40. As though being sexy and carefree is all I have to offer, and if those things go away, I'm nothing.
You've shown an impressive hypocrisy in your statements--one all too common in our culture. You've mentioned repeatedly that it's what's on the inside that matters, but don't seem to extend that same privilege to women. You don't want girls to make assumptions about you based on age, but heap assumptions on middle-aged women with an alarming zeal.
You talk about the trials of dating GIRLS my age:

Some girls my age are interested in men your age, and I can only speak for myself. But when I reject the advances of men old enough to be my father, it's not because I "ASSume" they don't have "hopes, dreams, fear of rejection, and love in [their] hearts." As I've stated, I think there's enormous value to be found in aging. I often enjoy spending time with my parents' friends--they can be fun to talk to, and bring another perspective. I don't doubt that men that age have feelings. But would I be interested in a relationship with one of them? No. I'm a student, and my life is very much based around the college. I want to be with someone who understands that, who's in a similar mindset.
And I enjoy sharing those little, generational memories with someone. It's nice to remember the same music, movies, books, and world events that shaped your childhood. Those things matter to me.
Obviously not all girls feel this way (completely fine by me! They're more than welcome to date who they like). But that's the perspective I'm coming from, and it's a valid one.

And it's upsetting that you would call girls like me judgmental for that. You think I should approach men of all ages with an open mind, because they may be good people and "it's what's on the inside that counts." But you're willing to make blanket judgements on women--happy to assume that they're bitter and lacking in fun. Consider that they, too, may have "hopes, dreams, fear of rejection, and love."

Mind you, I actually don't have a problem with age disparity (within reason). It's the way you talk about women that I've found very troubling.
You don't have to want to sleep with women your own age. But please don't say derisive things about them. Don't force personality traits on them. Discuss them with a little more respect. Consider, for a moment, that they have feelings and value.

You're a bit of a genius.

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

So, maybe I've only met the bitter ones...I'm sure there are some good ones out there, but the odds increase, seemingly exponentially, that age breeds bitterness.

Like I said, maybe you're hanging around with the wrong people in the wrong places.

Originally Posted by jannieC

I'm way hotter now (at 42) than I was when I was a young thang.

And good for you for it!

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

It sounds weird, but me too! I'm hit on, ten times more, now, than when I was 21. And I never would have dreamed it, in my wildest dreams. Life, is a strange, yet wonderful, journey.

It's like I didn't blossom, until I was 41.....I guess I didn't.And I had the most "productive" date, of my entire life, tonight(talking about our future). It's like I've been reborn, yet I'm still an atheist!

I'm literally in AWE of life, right now.

That's so cool, that you could have this awesome life - you know, at your advanced age. It's a miracle. Thank God you're a man.

Originally Posted by ButterCookie

Also, can I just point out. I'd rather sleep with a woman like Joan Jett than most girls my own age. She's experienced but not bittered, she's wise, she's more toned than any under 25's I've seen lately and I bet she wouldn't lie like a corpse in the bedroom

Looks like some of the youngsters here agree with me - are they taking it personally too? Just curious.

[mezzoforte]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with what you said, but you can't deny that Homer speaks from a place of truth- his truth- and his posts were not meant to inflame or offend others maliciously. You can either go through life with blinders on and assume that everyone appreciates internal beauty as much as external beauty and that age is age-less. But that's not realistic; everyone has their likes and dislikes, and everyone places different values on different traits. If anything, the real issue here is how/why some women choose to internalize the opinions of other people. Why can't we all just agree to disagree on matters that are highly subjective? Just because Homer is the only one to vocalize (text-ize?) his opinions doesn't mean he is the only who shares those views. The reality is that many (if not most) men prefer younger women, even if they are less sophisticated or worldly. As Patty Stanger (The Millionaire Matchmaker) often says, "The penis does the picking." It's in the DNA- the desire to mate with someone who is fertile and has a better chance of successfully producing offspring. And for whatever reason, the female of the species "dries up" faster than the male of the species, e.g., Rod Stewart being a new father in his sixties (shudders). Accordingly, the sexual allure of the female expires much more quickly than the male's. I'm not writing the rules; I'm just telling it like it is. Reality sucks, and women have an especially brutal road to travel as they age. It's not sheer coincidence that women are still the primary consumers of cosmetic surgical procedures.

I don't think anyone has denied that basic truth--that mother nature compels men to seek out fertile (and thus, younger) women. I don't hold his biology against him (although the disparity of the ages of his conquests is borderline skeevy to me).
But yes, he's hardly the only middle-aged man to be interested in young girls, and I haven't seen any posts that implied he is.
Buttercookie DID point out that many fathers of teenage girls are in their forties, and would not be thrilled at their daughters dating men of their age, and that it's irresponsible for men in positions of care to carry on with subordinates. Would you really argue with that? Pretty factual, no?

But I'm probably getting more controversial here.
Even given that all men are attracted to fertility, I think dating a girl young enough to be your daughter is pushing it. I'm not speaking specifically about Homer, here. But those college aged years are so important, I think. I know I've changed and matured a great deal just in the last two years. I think it's irresponsible for a 40-year-old to pull a 19-year-old into his world. It's robbing her of a part of her youth (again, not talking about Homer. I realize he didn't take it farther with the 19yo). It makes her the subordinate in the relationship, and lessens her opportunities to grow at her her own rate.

My parents started dating when my mother was 17, my father 24. Mum came from an enormously dysfunctional household, had monumental daddy issues, and by her own admission, was seeking a father figure. My father was a business school grad, working in banking, and hanging out with other young professionals. She was definitely more mature and experienced than your average teen--she'd been working and largely supporting herself through school. But even thought they're very happily married, she's told me she feels like she missed those years. She went to college, but lived with my father, didn't make college friends, and spent her time hanging out with people much older than herself (obviously 7 years isn't a huge gap in your forties, but it's considerable in terms of life experience the younger party is a teenager. Though she's very happy now, Mum has told me she can't help but be a bit jealous that I get to experience these years.

That's just one story--by no means is it representative. I'm trying to point out, though, that large age disparities can be harmful.
Again, I completely, totally get why older men are attracted to younger women. I'm just illustrating the perspective I'm coming from, and why I see it as problematic.

But I guess that's a slightly different topic. I'm less concerned with the preference for young girls than I am with the way older women are discussed. Because while the former is completely expected, and decreed by Mother Nature, the latter is offensive, careless, and and completely unnecessary.
The descriptions of women's personalities as we age have been sexist. I don't think we take sexism as seriously as racism or homophobia, and I wish I knew why.

What I and others have been offended by is the way he's stated his preferences. Whether intentional or not, his posts were inflammatory. Surely, it's offensive to say that "the odds increase, seemingly exponentially, that age breeds bitterness" (but only in women?). Or that 40-year-old women are generally "bitter, jaded, argumentative, and very little fun to be around."

There's a difference between not being attracted to older women, and declaring that we decay internally and externally as we age.

Buttercookie's post, quite rightly, pointed out that many women are made bitter by the men in their lives, or the criticisms women are subjected to.
It's possible that his bandmates' wives have always been wretched shrews (which I doubt--surely their husbands saw something they loved at one point). But in most bad marriages, there is fault on both sides. And there are many, many lovely women married to abusive, angry, or just loser husbands.
So perhaps it's worth considering that there's variety beyond his test group of...2 women.

So I guess I'm an embittered young woman. Certainly not in all areas, but yes--I'm bitter that I've been given an expiration date. So there you are--1 bitter young woman. You're halfway to being able to judge us all!

Homer, you've expressed a desire to move on from the topic. And indeed, I think we'll always disagree. But since you've offended multiple people, I would say the best way to end it is to apologize. If not for your basic views, for the fact that others were offended. Isn't that reason enough?

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

Why can't we all just agree to disagree on matters that are highly subjective? Just because Homer is the only one to vocalize (text-ize?) his opinions doesn't mean he is the only who shares those views. The reality is that many (if not most) men prefer younger women, even if they are less sophisticated or worldly.

And I fully realized that my posting my feelings, wasn't going to be a popular position, especially on this board. I'm just being honest. I DID mean what I said, though, that many older women, tend to be...well,....sort of...... bi*ches. Very unhappy people. I'm a very happy guy, and honestly, I'd rather be alone, than have to surround myself with negativity. YES, I GET, THAT NOT EVERY WOMAN IS LIKE THIS.
I do think we SHOULD just agree to disagree. Honestly, I'm on cloud nine right now, and just want to enjoy the excellent place that I'm in, right now.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by mezzoforte

But since you've offended multiple people, I would say the best way to end it is to apologize. If not for your basic views, for the fact that others were offended. Isn't that reason enough?

I will NOT apologize, for expressing my opinions, and experiences. This IS Chit Chat, and I'm only honestly expressing my opinions. If you don't like them, IGNORE them. GOD f*cking forbid, that a man gives his honest opinion. Because we've been silent long enough, living under this PC regime!(I was dying to use Rush's "f-N" quote, but I'll leave that one for Rush).

[skcin]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

And I fully realized that my posting my feelings, wasn't going to be a popular position, especially on this board. I'm just being honest. I DID mean what I said, though, that many older women, tend to be...well,....sort of...... bi*ches. Very unhappy people. I'm a very happy guy, and honestly, I'd rather be alone, than have to surround myself with negativity. YES, I GET, THAT NOT EVERY WOMAN IS LIKE THIS. I do think we SHOULD just agree to disagree. Honestly, I'm on cloud nine right now, and just want to enjoy the excellent place that I'm in, right now.

Thank you! Finally!

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by skcin

Is he attracted to 20 year olds? Of course, what man wouldn't be? But he bangs me, despite that fact that I'm a bitter, over the hill harpy according to your standards.

It's just that I don't think that's going to happen by serial dating younger chicks you meet at the bar. If all you want is a good time & to feel attractive (which you're equating to thin, but that's a whole other topic) then you're all set I guess. But I swore I remember you posting in the past that you're lonely & want to find the right person - no?

The reason I asked about the 23 year old is if you're serious about her, why are you still dating other chicks, like the 19 year old you "drew the line" at?

That's so cool, that you could have this awesome life - you know, at your advanced age. It's a miracle. Thank God you're a man.


Looks like some of the youngsters here agree with me - are they taking it personally too? Just curious.

Well, as long as he's not taping pictures to the headboard, I guess you're good to go.


This one, never goes to bars. Never. We were dating a year ago. And I'm not the one, that put it back together. And I was very apprehensive about it(about me being a yo-yo, again), so I was still dating others. Not anymore, because things are starting to get more serious. Last night's date, was incredible(no, not sexually. Emotionally.).

I know! Grandpa nails a hottie! Fortunately, Grandpa's at the top of his game. Grandpa got guessed as 25, on Saturday night!

I don't pretend to be able to pander to mass appeal. Only stating my preferences. Which clearly get under your skcin.

[skcin]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

Well, as long as he's not taping pictures to the headboard, I guess you're good to go.


This one, never goes to bars. Never. We were dating a year ago. And I'm not the one, that put it back together. And I was very apprehensive about it(about me being a yo-yo, again), so I was still dating others. Not anymore, because things are starting to get more serious. Last night's date, was incredible(no, not sexually. Emotionally.).

I know! Grandpa nails a hottie! Fortunately, Grandpa's at the top of his game. Grandpa got guessed as 25, on Saturday night!

I don't pretend to be able to pander to mass appeal. Only stating my preferences. Which clearly get under your skcin.

1) No, he keeps them under the bed. Cuz he's classy like that.
2) That's great. You might want to stop making dates with others then.
3) My husband gets carded & looks 19. Yay for him? I guess? He doesn't need that to boost his ego.
4) Your preferences don't bother me at all, truly they don't. However, your sexist & agist (is that word? ageist?) comments do. I hope you finally find happiness withe the right girl.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by skcin

1) No, he keeps them under the bed. Cuz he's classy like that.
2) That's great. You might want to stop making dates with others then.
3) My husband gets carded & looks 19. Yay for him? I guess? He doesn't need that to boost his ego.
4) Your preferences don't bother me at all, truly they don't. However, your sexist & agist (is that word? ageist?) comments do. I hope you finally find happiness withe the right girl.

1) A vivid imagination, is crucial.
2) Like I said, I'm not dating anyone else. I wouldn't even consider it now.
3)Good for Mark(?,if memory serves). Better that, than offering him a senior discount!
4)I'm as ageist as they come. More so concerning myself, than anyone. I threw away a decade of my life, and I'm reclaiming every minute of it!

[mezzoforte]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

I will NOT apologize, for expressing my opinions, and experiences. This IS Chit Chat, and I'm only honestly expressing my opinions. If you don't like them, IGNORE them. GOD f*cking forbid, that a man gives his honest opinion. Because we've been silent long enough, living under this PC regime!(I was dying to use Rush's "f-N" quote, but I'll leave that one for Rush).

DUDE. Saying that women tend to be bitches is hate speech. Compare it to saying that black people tend to be unintelligent criminals, or gay people tend to be effeminate wimps. I'm not a PC-crazy, but making offensive, stereotypical generalizations is not okay. It just isn't.

And anyway, I didn't even ask you to apologize for voicing your opinions, reprehensible as I find them. I asked you to apologize for having offended people. I didn't say you had to take anything back-- a simple "I'm sorry I said something that was hurtful to others." Isn't that a basic law we're supposed to master by age three? You hurt someone, you apologize.

But it doesn't seem like that will happen, and I feel pretty stupid, actually, for letting a 3-year-old rattle me. So I'm stepping away.