Hillary Clinton vs. Barack Obama: Of the two, who do you like?

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by Travis

I’m no political expert by any means and I can’t recall the order of the states won by each Obama and Clinton in the past few months but I remember reading an article after Obama had won 10 or maybe it was 11 straight wins in a row. The article went on to say which states would be won by each candidate and that Clinton would ultimately get the nomination. Again, not an expert but the states that the article predicted that Clinton would win she has in fact won so … maybe there is hope for Clinton yet.

It's not really about how many states you win as much as it is which states you win. And in general, Obama has won the sparsely populated, predominantly Republican states via caucuses, which are a complete joke and should be eradicated; caucuses heavily favored Obama. In states like Idaho, I think there were something like 5,000 caucus voters, or something ridiculously small like that. So by combing a few college campuses and bussing them in, Obama racked up huge numbers via the college students who had lots of free time to participate in the time-consuming caucus process, which discourages the participation of people who, um, actually have to work for a living. And it's quite telling that Hillary won the Texas primary decisively, yet lost the Texas caucus for the same reason. And then you have caucus states like Minnesota that went heavily for Obama, which, it should be noted, also elected Jesse "The Body" Ventura as their governor. The fact remains that Obama only won 2 large states and eked out a slight edge in one battleground state (Missouri). Hillary won all of the major large states and almost all of the battleground states by decisive margins; polls in those key battleground states are currently favoring her in the presidential election vs. McCain. This leaves me dumbfounded as to why superdelegates are not backing the candidate who can deliver the White House in November. I know there are many who hate Hillary, but as far as I am concerned, a superdelegate vote for Obama is a vote for McCain. They may as well already start printing up President McCain's Oval Office stationary now.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

I don't know. I am pretty sure the D will make damn sure that places like Harlem have enough voting machines. But, I suppose we'll see.

I don't think it's Harlem that will be a problem.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

Obama will win the general election and for one simple reason:

Hillary Clinton has not been able to get a big enough chunk of the independent vote.
Independents have come out in lop-sided margins for Barack Obama - and that is why he will be elected in November with some surprising new swing states in play. Watch Colorado, Virginia, Oregon, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Missouri, Michigan, and possibly Indiana.
His support has been broad - not unlike that of Reagan's when he was running for his first term.
The yellow pants suit express may have the poor/white/uneducated vote locked up, but elections aren't won with that bloc for Democrats. They are won by educated urban people in big cities along with swing voters.
All of the Appalachian states that Hillary is priding herself in winning will go to McCain anyway.
So her WV victory speech will be all about poor white dumb people tonight and she'll ride that wave until ultra-white Oregon goes overwhelmingly for Obama next week. Super-dels will continue to side with Obama every day until the last week of May when we can call it a day.

Educated Americans make the world go 'round. I find it pathetic to think that such a smart candidate like Clinton would alienate them from "day one". Given her background and education, it's hilarious to watch her call Obama elitist. He's worked his ass off and became the editor of the Harvard Law Review - credentials that are not unlike her own.

You will also find, my fine fellow political historians; that most of our presidents who we think of as "great"
did not go into office with what you define as experience. Often the most "experienced" first termers have ended up miserable failures.

I'm sure Lindsey Buckingham voted for Obama - but not so sure about Stevie.

There is so much wrong with this post that I don't even know where to start. I wish I had more time this morning. I'm kind of shocked that this talk is coming from you.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

I don't think it's Harlem that will be a problem.

Are you wearing your foil hat again

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

And there are also numerous inexperienced presidents who were horrendous. Carter? Grant?

Bush? What's that saying? Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it?

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

I'm still not quite sure why people are interested in John McCain.
I find him to be incredibly unexceptional.

Are voters really going to turn out for Grampa Munster over Barack Obama?

I talked to my daughter's grandmother about him this morning (she's 65 and voted for Bush in the last election). Her exact quote was "He needs to go take a nap." I laughed so hard.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Bush? What's that saying? Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it?

Bush and Carter had experience as Gov.'s - then again, so did Clinton

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

a few weeks ago Obama was quoted as saying "Hillary is throwing the china at me".

do you think it was the china she stole from the White House?

Maybe he meant to say "She's throwing the Chinese at me."

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

If cult of personality and media manipulation are all it takes to become president, I think Oprah should be running instead of Obama.

Her I think I could vote for at least. Depending on how this plays out, it's going to be hard for me to pull the lever for Obama.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

. . . it's going to be hard for me to pull the lever for Obama.

Meh - I did it and it wasn't that painful

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by BombaySapphire3

And did you not also say in regard to Obama becoming the Democratic nominee for President "it ain't gonna happen"? ..a rhetorical question I know..

Probably. But I've been wrong about a few things. I'm still not sure that he will be the nominee.

[HejiraNYC]

Originally Posted by gldstwmn

Her I think I could vote for at least. Depending on how this plays out, it's going to be hard for me to pull the lever for Obama.

But then we'd have Gail King as First Lady.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by dontlookdown

and i will enthusiastically vote for Hillary in November if she's the nominee.
But I'd rather punch the hole for Obama.

So - see...there's hope that we can unify as a party.

Unfortunately there are a lot of other people who don't feel that way.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by HejiraNYC

It's not really about how many states you win as much as it is which states you win. And in general, Obama has won the sparsely populated, predominantly Republican states via caucuses, which are a complete joke and should be eradicated; caucuses heavily favored Obama.

Agreed. When I first moved out west at the tender age of 18, I was shocked to find out I could not vote in a primary election. The caucus system is hugely flawed and unecessary in this day and age.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Are you wearing your foil hat again

When it comes to this kind of stuff you know I am.