Strange Things to Follow When You Love Someone/ the significance of Mabel Normand

[PenguinHead]

I have no agenda to change anyone's mind about the song; you either love it or hate it - fair enough. But the more I listen, the more intrigued and informed I am about the significance of it, in terms of Stevie's artistry.

The decision to add the middle "change sides" section was a smart decision because serves as a landing pad and gives the song some tangible structure. The second part of the song is essentially a recapitulation of the first part, but with some alternate phrases, and a few new lines/verses.

The lyrics have all the typical characteristics of Stevie's writing style. There is a story line, but the connections are somewhat loose and the references obscure. It's atypical because there is no traditional verse and chorus, just a barreling forward narrative. I think that is why some listeners are thrown off about it.

That approach reminded me of the bands like The Velvet Underground. They have a long winded spoken song , sans chorus, and verses called The Gift. (It's about a guy, geographically separated from by his girlfriend, who decides to mail himself in a box to surprise her. It ends tragically when she attempts to open the box with a knife).

My point is that the validity of a song is not bound to a set structure. It's a more challenging listen than a traditional form, and that's why it has a special distinction. Stevie rarely ventures into territory that more progressive, left of center artists pursue. That's why I'm so appreciative that she chose to take a less beaten path. It's a fresh, artistic change of pace; one that evokes very different reactions. She's making no apologies, challenging the listener. I love that!

[DauphineMarie]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

I have no agenda to change anyone's mind about the song; you either love it or hate it - fair enough. But the more I listen, the more intrigued and informed I am about the significance of it, in terms of Stevie's artistry.

The decision to add the middle "change sides" section was a smart decision because serves as a landing pad and gives the song some tangible structure. The second part of the song is essentially a recapitulation of the first part, but with some alternate phrases, and a few new lines/verses.

The lyrics have all the typical characteristics of Stevie's writing style. There is a story line, but the connections are somewhat loose and the references obscure. It's atypical because there is no traditional verse and chorus, just a barreling forward narrative. I think that is why some listeners are thrown off about it.

That approach reminded me of the bands like The Velvet Underground. They have a long winded spoken song , sans chorus, and verses called The Gift. (It's about a guy, geographically separated from by his girlfriend, who decides to mail himself in a box to surprise her. It ends tragically when she attempts to open the box with a knife).

My point is that the validity of a song is not bound to a set structure. It's a more challenging listen than a traditional form, and that's why it has a special distinction. Stevie rarely ventures into territory that more progressive, left of center artists pursue. That's why I'm so appreciative that she chose to take a less beaten path. It's a fresh, artistic change of pace; one that evokes very different reactions. She's making no apologies, challenging the listener. I love that!

Thank you SO much for this post. I have always loved Mabel Normand because of this structure. It never resolves to anything, but to me makes perfect sense as an incoherent thought. That way, anyone can make of it what they will. And also, the Velvet Underground comparison is spot on. There is a song called "Heroin" that is truly spectacular, has no chorus, no bridge, and no structure, and is simply incredible.

[mitzo]

One remarkable aspect of the song is that Stevie delivers it with such intensity. What she is singing obviously means a lot to her. You can almost get but not really. Her best stuff is like this. It makes little immediate sense, but draws you into her world where things make their OWN sense.

[KarmaContestant]

I can't express how much I love this song - her vocals, the intensity, the realism - it's all there. Stevie really channeled her 1985 self when she laid this track out.

My favorite verse has got to be the one about her 'friend". You know how poeple will ask for advice about a problem, and pretend it's for "a friend"? Well, that's how I interpret this verse:

So my friend is continuing on a destructive road
His life passes before him like an unfortunate circumstance
He and his 'friend' are at odds - and he is not winning

Which I interpret as:

So I am continuing down a destructive road
My life passes before me like an unfortunate circumstance
Me and my addiction are at odds, and I am not winning.

Why does someone always have to win?

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

I have no agenda to change anyone's mind about the song; you either love it or hate it - fair enough. But the more I listen, the more intrigued and informed I am about the significance of it, in terms of Stevie's artistry.

I don't think Mabel Normand is black or white. There's plenty of room for gray. I don't hate it at all. I just don't find it a song, but a spoken word piece with unrelated music attached to it. I see it as performance based prose -- and a legitimate piece of storytelling. It reminds me of a Spalding Gray monologue. That's why I put it in the category of Mrs. Scarrott's piece.

Michele

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by KarmaContestant

My favorite verse has got to be the one about her 'friend". You know how poeple will ask for advice about a problem, and pretend it's for "a friend"? Well, that's how I interpret this verse:

So my friend is continuing on a destructive road
His life passes before him like an unfortunate circumstance
He and his 'friend' are at odds - and he is not winning

Which I interpret as:

So I am continuing down a destructive road
My life passes before me like an unfortunate circumstance
Me and my addiction are at odds, and I am not winning.

Why does someone always have to win?

Interesting take on that verse. I've assumed the song was at least partially about her relationship with Joe Walsh. Stevie has never had any qualms with referring to herself in her songs as "her" and "she," so I have to assume Mabel Normand isn't an exception.

The song being partially about her relationship with Joe makes a lot of sense to me, at least. After all, they were dating and parting ways at that time because their addictions were killing them both. Stevie has mentioned how their relationship ended cold turkey- something that is repeatedly hinted at in Mabel Normand.

"So I moved away from the house that held nothing but waiting for messages"

and

"strange things to follow when you love someone, so you put that someone in exile"

and

"he called today he said don't give up. I ask him what are you talking about? I said things are not the same. Since you've been gone Rome burned down. And still it's all the same."

To me, all of this is pointing to Stevie's relationship with Joe, their drug addictions spiraling out of control, and having to abandon their relationship so they could survive. But that's just my take.

Originally Posted by michelej1

I don't think Mabel Normand is black or white. There's plenty of room for gray. I don't hate it at all. I just don't find it a song, but a spoken word piece with unrelated music attached to it. I see it as performance based prose -- and a legitimate piece of storytelling. It reminds me of a Spalding Gray monologue. That's why I put it in the category of Mrs. Scarrott's piece.

I absolutely agree Mabel Normand is more like a spoken word piece- one where a poet stands up and starts reciting their words to accompanying music they do not know beforehand. This is also why I think it's brilliant- the song is about a loss of control, about forging into the darkness. Artistically, I think it's one of the coolest things Stevie's ever done.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I absolutely agree Mabel Normand is more like a spoken word piece- one where a poet stands up and starts reciting their words to accompanying music they do not know beforehand.

I would agree with this description and, in that manner, I would contrast it with These Strange Times where I think the rhythm is not only matched to Mick's words, but that Mick's words also have a beat and syncopation all their own.

Michele

[SisterNightroad]

I also absolutely think that Mabel Normand is mainly about both cocaine and Joe Walsh. Am I the only one that sees some kind of similarity with "Races are run"?

"(And) you are not winning
Why does someone always have to win?
And all those races that are run"

"Races are run
Some people win
Some people always have to lose"

[KarmaContestant]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

To me, all of this is pointing to Stevie's relationship with Joe, their drug addictions spiraling out of control, and having to abandon their relationship so they could survive. But that's just my take.

Of course- it's probably about Joe. But this is a song about Mabel and how Stevie related to her, so I'd rather the lyrics be about one of them. Because Joe Walsh isn't exactly an inspirational persona to me.

[pryderi]

As others have said before, I wasn't a fan of the demo. I never got through the entire song. But, upon hearing the first few seconds of the new version I instantly fell in love with it. It's crazy!

[michelej1]

Oh, I think it's about Stevie and Joe in the same sense that Leather and Lace may have been about Stevie and not just Waylon Jennings and Jessi Colter, but I definitely see those lyrics as having to do with Mabel Normand too. I mean, I may have watched too much of A. J. Benza's Mysteries and Scandals when it was on the air, but Mabel Normand ran with a Hollywood crowd that rose to the heights of fames only to be slammed down by scandal, not only drugs and sex, but even murder.

So, when he and his friends are at odds and he is not winning, I think of William Desmond Taylor who was murdered by unknown persons -- but the rumor is that the culprits were Normand's own drug pals.

And a line like, "he began to hide his beauty" makes me think of someone other than Joe Walsh. It makes me think of people like Charlie Chaplin (who left America) or Fatty Arbuckle who were basically blacklisted and had their careers wither on the vine because the media and public turned against them. They suddenly had to live in shadow.

When Stevie says she feels guilty for even dying, I totally think of Mabel Normand and her tuberculosis.

[StreetAngel86]

Originally Posted by KarmaContestant

My favorite verse has got to be the one about her 'friend". You know how poeple will ask for advice about a problem, and pretend it's for "a friend"? Well, that's how I interpret this verse:

Which I interpret as:

So I am continuing down a destructive road
My life passes before me like an unfortunate circumstance
Me and my addiction are at odds, and I am not winning.

Why does someone always have to win?

why is she referring to herself as a man then?
why isn't this "friend" a woman?
i like the winning theme ... Races are Run ... some people win. some people always have to lose

ETA: totally did NOT see the previously commented on Races are Run post. GREAT MINDS

[jwd]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

I have no agenda to change anyone's mind about the song; you either love it or hate it - fair enough. But the more I listen, the more intrigued and informed I am about the significance of it, in terms of Stevie's artistry.

The decision to add the middle "change sides" section was a smart decision because serves as a landing pad and gives the song some tangible structure. The second part of the song is essentially a recapitulation of the first part, but with some alternate phrases, and a few new lines/verses.

The lyrics have all the typical characteristics of Stevie's writing style. There is a story line, but the connections are somewhat loose and the references obscure. It's atypical because there is no traditional verse and chorus, just a barreling forward narrative. I think that is why some listeners are thrown off about it.

That approach reminded me of the bands like The Velvet Underground. They have a long winded spoken song , sans chorus, and verses called The Gift. (It's about a guy, geographically separated from by his girlfriend, who decides to mail himself in a box to surprise her. It ends tragically when she attempts to open the box with a knife).

My point is that the validity of a song is not bound to a set structure. It's a more challenging listen than a traditional form, and that's why it has a special distinction. Stevie rarely ventures into territory that more progressive, left of center artists pursue. That's why I'm so appreciative that she chose to take a less beaten path. It's a fresh, artistic change of pace; one that evokes very different reactions. She's making no apologies, challenging the listener. I love that!

Excellent post. I very much enjoyed reading your take on Mabel. And I couldn't agree more.

[bombaysaffires]

I think I like the album version of Mabel because the demo was such a hot mess. The lyrics are still an indecipherable mess but somehow what Dave has done with the musical arrangement has made it compelling in a way that I for one totally did not anticipate. So turning it on and expecting it to be just a more elaborately produced pile, I was taken aback that it was somehow listenable…and then I had to play it again just to be sure I was hearing what I thought I was hearing…the repeated pattern of the chords, but then the more and more guitar layers added on as the song goes on. It just captivated me because it wasn't what I expected. Who knows what the hell she's talking about, but it has a really catchy groove.

[On Ice]

I agree with what the posts have touched on with Mabel. That Stevie chose her as a metaphoric backdrop for this song I think was brilliant. At the time of the Wild Heart and Rock a Little, I can't believe I was so oblivious to her relationship with Joe Walsh. The way that she tells this story with Mabel as the back drop challenges me and holds my interest through the song. "Change sides" gives the listener the heads up that we're going in a different direction now so get ready. Ending with the wonderfully sung "so beautiful" caps off one of Stevie's best moments in her solo career.