Stevie, Lindsey and Christine: all nominees for Songwriters Hall of Fame 2006

[Brwn_eyes0511]

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

Or maybe poor Christine is just the unfortunate victim of a growing backlash caused by some of her loutish and disrespectful fans?

I'm with you...

[DavidMn]

Good for them. I hope they all make it!!

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by ontheEdgeof17

I tend to think so....

"When you hang up the phone....you cease to exist..." That's good sh*t.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who actually likes "Welcome to the Room...Sara."

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by DavidMn

Good for them. I hope they all make it!!

I'm gonna go ahead and say I hope none of them do, at least this time around. Pete Townshend and Neil both deserve this honor well before any of those three.

[wondergirl9847]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

I'm glad I'm not the only one who actually likes "Welcome to the Room...Sara."

I've always liked that one. Stevie is the best lyricist, but they all have merits for needing to be in the HOF. I don't think it should be based on lyrics alone, because Lindsey can rip my heart out, make me cry, laugh and hum along with only a strum of his guitar.

[David]

Originally Posted by wondergirl9847

I've always liked that one. Stevie is the best lyricist, but they all have merits for needing to be in the HOF.

I don't think Stevie is a better lyricist than Lindsey or Chris. I think she just imbues her trippy words with more of herself, so they strike one as more truthful or passionate, whereas the other two typically stand back a bit & concoct a more rigorous, traditional structure.

I don't think any songwriter in Fleetwood Mac has ever been as skillful a lyricist as, say, Joni Mitchell or Dylan or any of the established greats. Those are people whose ability to wield just the right words in just the right rhythms pretty much outstrips the same ability of anyone in Fleetwood from '67 to the present. Not that it's totally conclusive, but it does say something about a widespread recognition that you can find English & literature courses devoted to Dylan or Joni Mitchell or Jim Morrison (as well as dozens of books & articles, even in peer-reviewed academic journals) on hundreds of university campuses; but you just don't find anything like that widespread study of Stevie's words or Peter Green's words or Christine's words.

In fact, that would make a good ledgie project: track down courses on the band's songwriters at colleges & universities, just for curiosity's sake.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by David

I don't think Stevie is a better lyricist than Lindsey or Chris. I think she just imbues her trippy words with more of herself, so they strike one as more truthful or passionate, whereas the other two typically stand back a bit & concoct a more rigorous, traditional structure.

I was actually just thinking yesterday that it's the fact that Stevie's lyrics are often so insrcutable and all-out bad that really gives some of her songs their charm, at least the more rocking ones. That kind of rambling relative meaninglessness, when she really belts it out and backs it up with bunch of rocking guitars or synths, is usually very effective. She makes it work.

[David]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

I was actually just thinking yesterday that it's the fact that Stevie's lyrics are often so insrcutable and all-out bad that really gives some of her songs their charm, at least the more rocking ones. That kind of rambling relative meaninglessness, when she really belts it out and backs it up with bunch of rocking guitars or synths, is usually very effective. She makes it work.

Definitely. She's an auteur -- she imprints her defining characteristics & personal style on her work, & people respond to that rapturously. I sure do. That's what's so buzzy about my responses to her, something I've always been proud of: I give in to Stevie's personal style but I don't confuse my rapturous response with the intrinsic quality of those songs. Stevie makes those songs stupid & unforgettable, but without her style behind them, they'd only be stupid & forgettable.

MY OPINION of course to those of you who are consistently offended by my stating my views....

[goldustsongbird]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

I'm glad I'm not the only one who actually likes "Welcome to the Room...Sara."

I like it.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by David

Definitely. She's an auteur -- she imprints her defining characteristics & personal style on her work, & people respond to that rapturously. I sure do. That's what's so buzzy about my responses to her, something I've always been proud of: I give in to Stevie's personal style but I don't confuse my rapturous response with the intrinsic quality of those songs. Stevie makes those songs stupid & unforgettable, but without her style behind them, they'd only be stupid & forgettable.

It's really a pretty amazing effect. She also has a knack for throwing senseless lines into a song that, taken as a whole, the whole thing is meaningless crap - but one or two random lines at a time will jump out at you and seem to be imbued with some kind of quirky profundity.

[strandinthewind]

Originally Posted by Jyqm

It's really a pretty amazing effect. She also has a knack for throwing senseless lines into a song that, taken as a whole, the whole thing is meaningless crap . . . .

Maybe to you. But to many it makes sense. Thus, her drawing power.

[sparky]

Originally Posted by David

Definitely. She's an auteur -- she imprints her defining characteristics & personal style on her work, & people respond to that rapturously. I sure do. That's what's so buzzy about my responses to her, something I've always been proud of: I give in to Stevie's personal style but I don't confuse my rapturous response with the intrinsic quality of those songs. Stevie makes those songs stupid & unforgettable, but without her style behind them, they'd only be stupid & forgettable.

Precisely and accurately put. Many of them would be. That is the root of the opinion that she is a triumph of style over substance. I think the ones that have been covered - Landslide in particular - tend to have an intrinsic quality that is fairly inarguable. But many of her songs are exactly as you state. Thus the reason she will never be in the same category of those she aspires to compare herself to. I have gotten into many lengthy arguments about this very subject. Most of which boils down to "Well I think this song is great. It makes me cry. I love it. Therefore she is great and her songs are great and that's all there is to it."

MY OPINION of course to those of you who are consistently offended by my stating my views....

I implore you to continue to post your eloquently stated and reasonably backed up opinions. And without apology to the walking wounded who are offended by every thing on earth that doesn't agree with their own precious veiws. I am really on a crusade to get the easily offended into therapy or on medication. What a bothersome, tiring turn that has been. I am over it.

[Jyqm]

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Maybe to you.

Well yeah. Duh.

Do you like my new signature?


_____
"MY OPINION of course to those of you who are consistently offended by my stating my views...." ~David

[Johnny Stew]

Originally Posted by sparky

I implore you to continue to post your eloquently stated and reasonably backed up opinions.

Just be careful you don't praise him too much there, Sparks... David IS fond of "When I See You Again," you know.

[ragandbone]

Originally Posted by David

I don't think any songwriter in Fleetwood Mac has ever been as skillful a lyricist as, say, Joni Mitchell or Dylan or any of the established greats. Those are people whose ability to wield just the right words in just the right rhythms pretty much outstrips the same ability of anyone in Fleetwood from '67 to the present. Not that it's totally conclusive, but it does say something about a widespread recognition that you can find English & literature courses devoted to Dylan or Joni Mitchell or Jim Morrison (as well as dozens of books & articles, even in peer-reviewed academic journals) on hundreds of university campuses...

I recall Joni Mitchell, Paul Simon, Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen (fave)at the end of my textbooks in some literature survey classes, but I had no idea Jim Morrison was being studied in Universities. I loved the Doors, but IMO, Morrison's lyrics are pretty stinky when studied sober.